82

To be, or not to be: Bill’s Battle of Britain clasp

In 2013 I visited the Battle of Britain memorial on the Thames in London. Excitedly I looked for my grandfathers name, but never found it. I wondered if they had mixed up his four names and looked for him under different surnames. But no. I looked online, everywhere that has lists of names of those that are among ‘the few’, and he is listed on none of them.

In June of 2015 I began the development of, and research for, the first moosemartyn.com. An undertaking which took seven months before its launch on December 14, 2016. During that time I tried many times to ascertain how and why Bill came to have the B.o.B. clasp. I approached a couple of experts, and the people at the Battle of Britain memorial, but received little more than a shrug. On the original website there was an ‘Awards’ page where I outlined how he had earned the DSC and Bar, M.i.D.’s and explained the Service Medals and clasps. I left out the B.o.B. clasp, because I could not explain when and why.

Here, clearly, is Lt. Cdr. William W. H. Martyn’ Battle of Britain clasp. What is not clear, is how he came to have it.

Picture of Bill's medals

Picture of Bill’s medals

Bill served on 801(FF) squadron during the Battle of Britain and for most of June to November 1940 the squadron was stationed at RNAS Hatston, in the Orkney’s. There are only (officially) two FAA squadrons that took part; 804 and 808. As it happens 804 was stationed at RNAS Hatston during the same period. There are two key differences between the two: 804 was under RAF Fighter Command, and 801 wasn’t. And secondly, 804’s operations were over British territory (primarily protecting Scapa Flow) while 801 was participating in operations over Norway (from Hatston and HMS Furious). 801 was primarily operating the Blackburn Skua, a dive bombing/fighter aircraft which was well suited to attacking shipping and ground installations, but was inadequate for engaging fighters. 804 was operating Gloster Sea Gladiators, the last bi-plane developed for combat in WWII. The Gloster (Sea) Gladiator is one of the aircraft considered to have taken part in the Battle of Britain, but the Blackburn Skua is not.

Although 801 would have faced resistance from Luftflotte 5 (which had been involved in the invasion of Norway and was based there through-out the war) in the North Atlantic and over Norway, the fact that they were not operating certain aircraft and were not assigned to RAF Fighter Command seems to have ensured they were left out by the ‘list makers’. The original list included no Fleet Air Arm squadrons or pilots (unless the pilot was assigned to an RAF sqn. that was on the list). 804 and 808 squadrons were added sometime after 1960. Apparently the criteria for inclusion has changed at times, with some squadrons and pilots who were on the original list being removed, and others added.

There is the possibility that the Admiralty deemed that Bill had met the criteria and issued him the clasp. Here is an excerpt from THE ORIGINS OF AIRCREW WHO FOUGHT IN THE BATTLE OF BRITAIN Dr Tony Mansell:

Nos 804 and 808 Sqns of the Fleet Air Arm (FAA) operated under Fighter Command control during the Battle along with a further twenty-five naval pilots who flew on loan to RAF squadrons. The Navy, being a law unto itself; dealt with the issue of Clasps in Admiralty Fleet Orders (AFO) 2686 and 3115 of 1945. The Admiralty were not subject to an AMO for permission to do that but should have taken note of the RAF squadrons which the relevant AMOs had accredited.

I am hoping to see AFO’s 2686 and 3115 when I visit Kew in the Fall.

From the Battle of Britain Memorial website, “There are debates to this day about the eligibility criteria for the Clasp and new names are sometimes added to the list, but the Battle of Britain Memorial Trust has no jurisdiction over the list of men known as the Few.”

From the gov.uk website:

Clasps are worn on the ribbon of the 1939 to 1945 Star.

To apply for the Battle of Britain Clasp to the 1939-45 Star, you must have:

  • served as aircrew on a fighter aircraft
  • been engaged in the Battle of Britain between 10 July 1940 and 31 October 1940

Could they be any more vague?

What is considered to have ‘been engaged in the Battle of Britain’?
If it is to have been operating fighter aircraft against German aircraft during the prescribed dates, than 801 is an obvious inclusion. Although the Blackburn Skua is not strictly a ‘fighter’ it certainly engaged the enemy as one.

I find myself with more grey hairs than when I began to write this. I expect there are many more to come.

Lastly (for now), were all 801 pilots given the clasp, or just Bill?
Either way, the questions of when and why persist. Moreover, why does he have the clasp, but is not listed as having been a participant in the Battle of Britain? The two are intrinsically tied.

This does posit another question: Was Bill Martyn given the clasp in error?

To be continued . . .

Comments 82

  1. Reply

    Great question! I have done some research at KEW and may have some useful insight. My wife’s father also served with FAA 801 Squadron serving on HMS FURIOUS and based at Hatston the same time as your grandfather. His service record indicates award of the Battle of Britain clasp, but he has also been omitted from the memorial. I have been working on writing the story of Petty Officer (Pilot) Richard H. Williams (retired as Lt Cdr, RN) for some time so that he is not forgotten. My contact details are below.

  2. Reply

    I don’t have the full Air Ministry Order but this may help with how and who qualified and following AMO’s supplemented this list (ie FAA squadrons and Bomber Command Sqds). It reads Air Ministry Order on 23 July 1945

    (AMO A.741/1945) which in part stated that:

    ‘Issues of silver-gilt rose emblems denoting a Clasp to the 1939-45 Star may be made to aircrew personnel who flew in fighter aircraft engaged in the Battle of Britain between 10th July 1940 and 31st October 1940.

    Issues are to be confined to those who operated with the undermentioned squadrons:

    ‘Nos 1, 17, 19, 23, 25, 29, 32, 41, 43, 46, 53, 54, 56, 59, 64, 65, 66, 72, 73, 74, 79, 85, 87, 92, 111, 141, 145, 151, 152, 213, 219, 222, 229, 234, 235, 236, 238, 242, 249, 253, 257, 264, 266, 302, 303, 310, 312, 401 (No 1 RCAF Squadron), 501, 504, 600, 601, 602, 603, 604, 605, 607, 609, 610, 611, 615 and 616 …

    ‘COs are not to admit claims for this highly-prized emblem which are open to any possible doubt. The Clasp is not available for personnel who flew in aircraft other than fighters, notwithstanding that they may have been engaged with the enemy in the air during the qualifying period.

  3. Reply
  4. Reply
  5. Reply
  6. Reply
  7. Reply
  8. Reply
  9. Reply
  10. Reply
  11. Reply
  12. Reply
  13. Reply
  14. Reply
  15. Reply
  16. Reply
  17. Reply
  18. Reply
  19. Reply
  20. Reply
  21. Reply
  22. Reply
  23. Reply
  24. Reply
  25. Reply
  26. Reply
  27. Reply
  28. Reply
  29. Reply
  30. Reply
  31. Reply
  32. Reply
  33. Reply
  34. Reply
  35. Reply
  36. Reply
  37. Reply
  38. Reply
  39. Reply
  40. Reply
  41. Reply
  42. Reply
  43. Reply
  44. Reply
  45. Reply
  46. Reply
  47. Reply
  48. Reply

    Yo, x444game! Heard some buzz about this one. Gonna check it out and see if it lives up to the hype. Wish me luck! Click here: x444game

  49. Reply

    Alright, x444shn, you’re up next! Hoping for some good times and maybe a few wins. Fingers crossed. Check it out guys: x444shn

  50. Reply
  51. Reply
  52. Reply
  53. Reply
  54. Reply
  55. Reply
  56. Reply
  57. Reply
  58. Reply
  59. Reply
  60. Reply
  61. Reply

    JILI8 Online Casino Philippines: Quick JILI8 Login, Register & App Download. Play the Best JILI8 Slots and Win Big Today! Experience JILI8 Online Casino Philippines! Quick JILI8 login & register to play top JILI8 slots. Get the JILI8 app download for mobile fun & win big today! visit: jili8

  62. Reply

    Oklaro Philippines: The Ultimate Online Slot Destination. Register & Login now, Download the App, or access our official Link Alternatif for the best gaming experience! Experience Oklaro Philippines, the ultimate online slot destination! Secure your Oklaro login & Oklaro register today for top Oklaro slot games. Oklaro download the mobile app or use our official link alternatif for 24/7 gaming action. visit: oklaro

  63. Reply
  64. Reply

    82jllink… haven’t heard of it before. Time to dive in and see what’s cooking. If it’s good I’ll be spending some serious time here. You know, a little bit of fun never hurt nobody Let’s check 82jllink!

  65. Reply

    Tried my luck at lotogreenbet the other day. Didn’t win big, but it was a smooth experience. They’ve got a decent variety of games. I’d recommend it give it a try! lotogreenbet

  66. Reply
  67. Reply
  68. Reply
  69. Reply

    Heard about redatorbateubet from a mate down the pub. Gave it a look and it’s…alright. Seems like a pretty standard betting site, with some decent games. If you’re looking for something new give redatorbateubet a spin.

  70. Reply
  71. Reply

    Alright Beephcasino, let’s be real. I’ve been around the block and this casino has some serious potential. Good game selection and seems legit. Give it a spin! beephcasino

  72. Reply
  73. Reply
  74. Reply

    One88SBS, another sportsbook huh? Well, gotta check the odds and see if theres any good value. Hope so! Could use a good win. one88sbs

  75. Reply

    Yo dawg, heard you like casinos? Well, I stumbled upon wz777casino and it wasn’t half bad. They got some cool slots and the bonus system seems alright. Peep it wz777casino

  76. Reply

    Aight, so z25casino caught my eye with their slick design. Games are running smooth, and withdrawal process seems legit so far. Giving it a thumbs up z25casino

  77. Reply

    Yo, 1001juegos is the spot for some casual fun. They got a mad selection of free games to kill time with. Perfect for when you’re bored at work, ya know 1001juegos

  78. Reply

    [9210]Swerte99 Online Casino Philippines: Login, Register & App Download for Top Slot Games Experience the best at Swerte99 Online Casino Philippines. Quick Swerte99 login & register for top Swerte99 slot games. Get the Swerte99 app download and win big today! visit: swerte99

  79. Reply

    [3166]GGPanalo: The Leading Online Casino in the Philippines. Register and Login to play GGPanalo Slots or get the official GGPanalo App Download for big wins! GGPanalo is the leading online casino in the Philippines. Fast GGPanalo login & register to play premium GGPanalo slots. Get the GGPanalo app download for big wins! visit: ggpanalo

  80. Reply
  81. Reply
  82. Reply

Comments are like War Bonds. Do your part.

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.